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Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats etc
http://hpbc.ca/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=319		 Page 2 of 4
Author:  DoktorC [ June 13th, 2012, 7:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
WalkWithMax wrote:
Don,
You made some great points there! Safety is number one! I had so much fun on the weekend! Todd mentioned that racing in the states is so cut throat! Everyone takes it way too seriously! We have such a great bunch of guys to race with! ...although I haven't ran with the Dok yet?! :D Can't wait for Gravenhurst! 8-)



Don't worry about me...you've got me by about 6mph. I'm just out for the cruise ;)...

Eric...if we have the opportunity to run that format we should. That not only is the most fair for everyone but it actually adds an extra heat for those who don't transfer out of E1 or E2....I like extra chances...I mean laps..lol
Author:  daveee [ June 13th, 2012, 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
HI
Generating more and ongoing interest in T class is paramount, so don't take what i'm saying here as anything negative about the class.
My take on all this is that no matter how you slice it, to be fair we must run boats with similar power together. Not similar driving experience. (Like any other class)
A 49 is simply not competitive with a 56. If the 49 were allowed more compression or whatever to get similar power to a 56, then it would be fair. As Don said, people will loose interest if they aren't competitive, for what ever reason.
I have already got a taste of this myself in 25ssH. My rig is too heavy by 25 lbs, (OK...I'm too heavy) and my motor had a scored cylinder plus other issues. I did my best but was very frustrated to see others pass me with sheer speed.
I should mention that OMC never built a 56 Stinger / Hustler. Every one of them is a Frankenstein.
So to be clear, if you are going to run 56 against 49's, the 49's should have more leeway toward mods, IE compression > 160 lb. OR;

My choice would be 49 is a different class than the 56's, yet run together in the same race. (Scored separately... like the other classes) :idea:
Author:  DoktorC [ June 13th, 2012, 8:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
daveee wrote:
A 49 is simply not competitive with a 56. If the 49 were allowed more compression or whatever to get similar power to a 56, then it would be fair. As Don said, people will loose interest if they aren't competitive, for what ever reason.


If you believe this to be true then run a 56. I'm in the same boat as you (pun intended) and if I NEED to win I'll spend the money and buy a 56...the cost of the change would be minimal (for you moreso than me even).

It is clear, however, after this weekend that the 49 IS in fact VERY competitive with the 56...didn't Jake place third in his first race? You guys have that boat set on kill and from what little I saw in the pictures and video it looks like Jake can drive it...he's turning bigger numbers than most 56's too.

The 56 and sst60 have been legal motors in this class since day one so there's no real reason that anyone coming into the class should be surprised that they are there and that some are fast. If I can't make my Yamaha competitive I'm not going to quit racing....racers don't lose interest in racing...I'll adapt just like everyone else has.
Author:  hcdcanada [ June 13th, 2012, 8:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
since im such a nice guy i have a suggestion to resolve this issue, by brand new stock tohatsu 50hp off me and then everyone has the same power lol, :D
Author:  Hounddog [ June 13th, 2012, 8:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
Dave's comment:
My choice would be 49 is a different class than the 56's, yet run together in the same race. (Scored separately... like the other classes)
So what do we do with the 70 Yamaha and the 60 cubic inch Mercury. Both of those motors have less prop shaft horsepower than the 49 OMC? Do we have even more spec mods for them? How do we enforce the mod rules? Do we allow the OMC to run OMC Mod 50 parts?
Better solution
I bet if you wanted to have the OMC 49 scored by itself, no one would object. Just get three or four more guys with 49s to agree and we can always have you together in the same grouping.
Author:  Hounddog [ June 13th, 2012, 9:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
Just a note was to why the 56 OMC was put in the class.
[1] other than the crank, it is easier, less costly to build than a 49.
[2] the 56 was in the FV PPR class, so there were boats and motors already there.
[3] the FV guys who raced against Jim's Yamaha thought a 49 could not compete.
[4] Mercury want the 60 cubic model in the FV class, so the displacement was raised to 60
and that allowed the OMC in.
[5] in the early 90's [1994 or 95] the 56 OMC was tested in CBF EP. It never won a heat. Fast off the dock.
But slower in the straights. Talk to Rob Gordon he ran one.

So it was not new to have the 56 in the class. The name of the class has changed from FE. EP, FV to T850.
Author:  SHIVERS [ June 13th, 2012, 9:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
Maybe we need a t boat unlimited class! then the real crazies can have at each other!
Author:  SST60RYE [ June 13th, 2012, 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
lets just race, lets stop fussing over ci, bring what you got, there is no dominant motor, its luck and driver, im in it for the fun only... period
Author:  Hounddog [ June 13th, 2012, 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
SHIVERS wrote:
Maybe we need a t boat unlimited class! then the real crazies can have at each other!


Already tried in APBA FV. MOD MOTORS, then bigger motors. bigger boats, safety cells. Class was dead in 2 years.
No need to repeat history.
Author:  DoktorC [ June 13th, 2012, 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Open discussion on the T Engine rules, Running of heats
daveee wrote:
I should mention that OMC never built a 56 Stinger / Hustler. Every one of them is a Frankenstein.


Sorry...I missed this the first time around...but 98% of the field are frankenstein motors of some form. My mid isn't factory, there's stingers with trim, there's OMC's with Yamaha trim...oddly enough the 56's on the sst60 mids are probably the closest thing we have to a factory motor lol (except Jim's Yamaha)...

I don't have an issue if you want to have the 49s scored separately either...but honestly you can look in the overall standings at the end of the year and pick out the 49's yourself...you win the same thing :mrgreen:
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